Here ya go!

 

 

 

Loving it!

I might have missed a previous post about this but it definitely the “cheap” 24 seat Endeavour.  Great theming.  Junky rides. 

“Cheap” is an overstatement considering the chain has invested millions of dollars in KI over the last decade alone..

Also, “junky”? What’s junky about modern versions of old favorites that people have been wanting back for years? 

I think they figure in 5-7 million in capex a year in general improvements with larger amounts for coasters. How much more should they invest @super7 to make you happy?

8 hours ago, BeeastFarmer said:

I think they figure in 5-7 million in capex a year in general improvements with larger amounts for coasters. How much more should they invest @super7 to make you happy?

@super7 put "cheap" in quotes meaning that the 24- seat model is cheap relative to the 48-seat model. To me, this complaint is legitimate.

The $5-7 million is for all park upkeep as well as the new rides and theming. Even an off year with no new attraction will cost a couple million spent on small things here and there.

Following your point though, If they are spending $5-7 million shouldn't the ride be capable of handling the volume it will likely need? If $5-7 million is being spent what is another $100k or $200k for the 48-seat model? (I have no idea the actual amount, but I can't imagine it's more than that).

If the extra money really was a sticking point, I  find it hard to believe that the difference in cost could not be taken from something else in the park's budget (at least for the this year) just to make it right. This is the first investment in three years and some could reasonably argue they're cutting corners with the money spent on capacity and the money put forth to get everything open on time.

Maybe it'll be a non-issue and the line doesn't back up, but seeing how long they built the queue line they likely expect longer waits.

I really do not get the decision to go for the lower capacity Zamperla Endeavor. If money was an issue, Diamondback’s repaint or The Racer’s retracking could have been pushed back. Theming could have even been cut to budget for the larger capacity model. It doesn’t really make sense why Kings Island went with the lower capacity model. I think it is either a deliberate business decision (Fast Lane sales will probably increase with such long lines) or Kings Island had to settle for the lower capacity Zamperla Endeavor to get it open in time for the season.

Has it been announced if these new rides will be able to operate during Winterfest?

Thankfully KI chose the 24 Endeavor model. Being that they’re 2 months behind on this currently could you imagine them attempting to open a 48 Endeavor model??? It would probably take them twice as long, being that it’s double the ride essentially. They would have to change the banner on the wall from saying “Coming this Summer!” to “New Haunt attraction!”.

I think perhaps we should all just wait and see how the 24-seater performs alongside the other rides. Maybe there are reasons that they are not expecting the need for a higher throughput. I'm willing to take a leap of faith on Cedar Fair's judgement here, particularly during a period of prolonged economic slump the globe seems to be in. I feel like things may make more sense this time next year.

7 hours ago, KI Guy said:

@super7 put "cheap" in quotes meaning that the 24- seat model is cheap relative to the 48-seat model. To me, this complaint is legitimate.

The $5-7 million is for all park upkeep as well as the new rides and theming. Even an off year with no new attraction will cost a couple million spent on small things here and there.

Following your point though, If they are spending $5-7 million shouldn't the ride be capable of handling the volume it will likely need? If $5-7 million is being spent what is another $100k or $200k for the 48-seat model? (I have no idea the actual amount, but I can't imagine it's more than that).

If the extra money really was a sticking point, I  find it hard to believe that the difference in cost could not be taken from something else in the park's budget (at least for the this year) just to make it right. This is the first investment in three years and some could reasonably argue they're cutting corners with the money spent on capacity and the money put forth to get everything open on time.

Maybe it'll be a non-issue and the line doesn't back up, but seeing how long they built the queue line they likely expect longer waits.

My comment was moreso directed at the fact that Super7 complains constantly about just about everything related to KI/CF instead of the size of the ride.  I'd be willing to wager that if the company spent 200 million per year at each park, they'd still be unhappy. 

I’d rather have a 24 seat model and impressive thematic elements for the whole area as opposed to the 48 seat model on an empty concrete pad. 

6 hours ago, CorkscrewMcPuke said:

I think perhaps we should all just wait and see how the 24-seater performs alongside the other rides. Maybe there are reasons that they are not expecting the need for a higher throughput. I'm willing to take a leap of faith on Cedar Fair's judgement here, particularly during a period of prolonged economic slump the globe seems to be in. I feel like things may make more sense this time next year.

Of course opening year will make it look like it was a bad decision, but it will be the lines the following years that determine if this was a short-sided mistake.  There are reasons for the decision.  Either they felt like the close proximity to other rides and it wasn't needed or they couldn't get their hands on the 48 seater in time or any other reason.  Or maybe this off-season the 48 seater shows up here and the 24 seater shows up in Planet Snoopy or another park LOL.

I don't buy the prolonged economic slump theory though and I don't think financial reasons drove the decision for the 24 seater.  Remember 2022 was a record year for Cedar Fair.  And 20 and 21 were not the doom & gloom post covid that many thought it would be - for many indicators they were record setting components.  Remember that during Winterfest 21 (and offseason 21/22) that Slingshot was being repainted with the idea that it would open in 2022 and for many years thereafter.  Then Slingshot disappeared a few weeks into the 2022 operating schedule.  So these rides were a "last minute" decision being made knowing that they more than recovered from the Covid year and the outlook was looking great for the parks. 

If the budget had to go into theming, then I am fine with the 24-seater.  Maybe they expect lines to be lower after the initial opening.  Plus we do know how much of the budget is going to AE.  I am anxious to see what improvements they made with it.

1 hour ago, beastfan11 said:

I’d rather have a 24 seat model and impressive thematic elements for the whole area as opposed to the 48 seat model on an empty concrete pad. 

Exactly! Plus over time I think it will even out. 

Let's be happy CF is actually investing money in KI.  Carowinds and CP are also getting major new areas and new rides that cost millions. CF could've just scrapped Adventure Port and poured all their interest and money into Carowinds and CP. Let's be grateful we get anything.

2 hours ago, ShedTreeBoi1 said:

Let's be happy CF is actually investing money in KI.  Carowinds and CP are also getting major new areas and new rides that cost millions. CF could've just scrapped Adventure Port and poured all their interest and money into Carowinds and CP. Let's be grateful we get anything.

See I think that’s flawed thinking. Yes, customers should be grateful, but it’s not like the attendance and spending numbers don’t justify the investment. Statements like that make it sound like it’s a “gift” not a solid business decision. Investments are planned and budgeted corporately as well as locally, so the money spent reflects both corporate desire to increase attendance and spending as well as reinvestment of the financial contribution of the specific regional park. 

From the park:

Judging by this, we should have Adventure Port open on June 19th: https://www.visitkingsisland.com/new-in-2023/adventure-of-a-lifetime

25 minutes ago, brenthodge said:

See I think that’s flawed thinking. Yes, customers should be grateful, but it’s not like the attendance and spending numbers don’t justify the investment. Statements like that make it sound like it’s a “gift” not a solid business decision. Investments are planned and budgeted corporately as well as locally, so the money spent reflects both corporate desire to increase attendance and spending as well as reinvestment of the financial contribution of the specific regional park. 

I don’t think the average guest really looks at capacity and judges it like enthusiasts do. The average park goer won’t be waiting in line thinking “they should’ve gotten the larger model.”
 

Historically our park hasn’t received a lot of flat rides under Cedar Fair in comparison to other parks in the chain so perhaps going with the lower capacity models will help the chain monitor ridership numbers so they can make decisions down the road.

2 hours ago, ShedTreeBoi1 said:

Let's be happy CF is actually investing money in KI.  Carowinds and CP are also getting major new areas and new rides that cost millions. CF could've just scrapped Adventure Port and poured all their interest and money into Carowinds and CP. Let's be grateful we get anything.

Cedar Fair is not investing in Kings Island because they’re trying to be nice or something. Kings Island getting an investment is solely based on what’s best for Cedar Fair as a business. They should be grateful they are in industry with fans who are willing to justify everything the company does.

Scenario to consider.

Corporate says you have (lets just put a fake number to this) 3 Million to work with on your new Adventure Port area of the park. You really want to add 2 new flats in the area. Cargo Loco is 1 million, Adventure Express updates .5 Million, Theming the new area and painting existing structures is .5 million. Sol Spin 48 person is 1.5 million or the 24 Person is $950,000. Do you skip the ride totally because you wanted the 48 person or buy the 24 person that is within your budget?

If I was park management, I know I would pick the 24 person to get a second ride.

I’m not even angry at the size of Sol Spin, I’m angry at the fact it’s almost June and it’s still under construction. Maybe @super7is onto something saying they’re junky “cheap” rides, maybe not so much the “rides” itself, but the manufacturer Zamperla. When I was at CP yesterday Wild Mouse was down for the entire day, and from reports I’m seeing, it is closed today too. Also I read in an Article about how Wild Mouse broke down and people had to be evacuated off the ride during its preview day, in-front of the media for all to see. How embarrassing. 
 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/experience/theme-parks/2023/05/05/cedar-point-wild-mouse-boardwalk/70186969007/

In regards to the capacity of the Endeavour,  I do wonder if the 48 seat model has similar issues to the OG Enterprises.   Some people are happy to sit beside someone but I often see people wanting their own row/car/cage whatever with flat rides in general.   While the 48 technically can hold double the amount of people when you factor in everything else I really doubt actual capacity doubles.   

I'm more upset that Der Spinnin Ke....  I mean Cargo Loco doesn't have a tilting platform. 

4 minutes ago, AintNutinElse2Do said:

In regards to the capacity of the Endeavour,  I do wonder if the 48 seat model has similar issues to the OG Enterprises.   Some people are happy to sit beside someone but I often see people wanting their own row/car/cage whatever with flat rides in general.   While the 48 technically can hold double the amount of people when you factor in everything else I really doubt actual capacity doubles.   

I'm more upset that Der Spinnin Ke....  I mean Cargo Loco doesn't have a tilting platform. 

You just hit on why I think they didn’t go to the extra expanse. If capacity could be higher by adding more single seats, then yes, I think they would’ve done it, but the way it’s structured I think they didn’t see it changing things too much throughput wise. 

I still think they probably wanted the 48 and just had to settle for the 24 at the last minute. Could be wrong, but with coasters the park has clearly favored higher capacity. I don't see the 24 seater increasing FL purchases by any significant margin.

And while its going to suck this first year, down the road the capacity probably won't matter that much outside of the busiest days.

KI's past problems with 'giant' flat rides (see Tomb Raider, a Giant Top Spin and Delirium, a Giant Frisbee) may  have deterred them from getting the bigger model as well. 

Lots of new crates and barrels around Adventure Port today!

20 hours ago, FUN&ONLY! said:

or Kings Island had to settle for the lower capacity Zamperla Endeavor to get it open in time for the season.

Well, last time I checked were over a month into "the 2023 season" and they just now assembled the ride. Sure I get the argument that a higher capacity ride would have cost a little more and taken a little longer to assemble but if it's not going to be open for opening weekend and it's going to open "during the season at some point" than what the heck just get the bigger one. All I can think of is that perhaps they don't think the capacity will be an issue after the opening season or perhaps it wasn't in the budget (as in the extra money got funneled to Adventure Express or the new restaurants). Regardless I'm still excited that we're getting something new this year because I was assuming it would be a big bust year with no additions. However, I do wish it had been planned and executed better seeing as the delayed opening is very frustrating. Everything I'm seeing is looking really good though so I really hope they wrap up soon! 

Looks like they painted the fence today with all the railings covered.


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