Kenban

My understanding is they are finishing up projects from before the decision to sell the land and close the park. If I remember correctly the spokesman even stated when the announcement was made the park would continue to see capital investments including rides. My feeling is this project was just too far along to easily cancel, they likely had already done the engineering work, purchased the ride, etc. All that was left was the actual construction work and the contacts were likely already signed for that.

This also makes a Kings Island annual pass more expensive than even Cedar Point, which is selling gold passes for $99. The only park in the chain more expensive is Knott’s Berry Farm who has not announced 2023 pricing yet.

I believe the reason for the wording is that not all of the parks are getting prestige passes. To my knowledge it is only Cedar Point, Kings Island, and Carowinds. If the park does not sell the prestige pass the extra benefits do not apply. At the rest of the chain you still will only get the regular platinum benefits. The wording is terrible and makes me wonder if there was an idea to only introduce it at one park.

Carowinds already accidentally confirmed the new area. If you go to Carowinds website it’s listed under rides and experiences. New in 2023: Aeronautica Landing

There is a picture of the train with the last car hanging in some news articles. It appears that one of the two wheel assemblies has completely separated from the train. This is not the first time this coaster has derailed. The first time was soon after it opened and it was found that the manufacturer used low quality bolts. At that time someone had to have a leg amputated, this is the first death as far as I know.

A similar thing happened to a 15 year old boy at the park in 2019. I am just giving some history and context. In that instance I believe it was the wave pool while this time it was an activity pool. These kinds of accidents happen too frequently. Typically it occurs in pools where you are participating in a physical activity beyond just swimming, most often it seems to be wave pools. Individuals over estimate their abilities or just tire themselves out without even realizing it sometimes and get into distress. I guess my best suggestion is for parents to monitor their children, and don’t wait for them to be tired, force them to take breaks.

I think it will be a smaller more family friendly woody. Worlds of Fun already has a modern GCI and an older Dinn wooden. Thinking about what a younger park guest has for choices you would start with a Wacky Worm. The next step up is a Gerstlauer Spinning coaster. Then it’s the adult coasters like Prowler. Basically the park could really use a Woodstock Express style of ride. A family Gravity Group like Oscar’s Wacky Taxi would be a fantastic fit for the park. Plus they are cheap and from what I have heard easy to maintain, and likely even easier now with the new track design. I am not sure how many people have ridden Oscar’s Wacky Taxi or Roar-O-Saurus, but they are amazing for a childrens ride. Don’t just ignore them because they are kiddy rides I honestly prefer them to a lot of bigger coasters.

The park posted a new official video. It has the changed drones, very clear audio, and splices together the show from several camera locations including the international restaurant.

Just a warning this is fake. That project number is for a property at 1622 First St. The image was modified to change the date, project number, and the description.

It’s a 6 year lease with a possible 5 year extension. But the new land owner can terminate the lease at any time with 2 years notice. So I suspect Cedar Fair plans to stay until the end of the 2027 season and then close the park giving them a few months to move what they want to keep. But if the land owner wants to they can terminate the lease tomorrow and while Cedar Fair has until the middle of 2024 to vacate that basically means 2023 would be the last season. The last year of the lease is more to wind down operations and move rides, not to operate the park.

I searched for the project your showing as your example. That site is 61.7 acres not 25 like you claim. The companies proposal actually includes property they do not even own. The company does own the majority of the site and it’s used for a number of retailers in several separate buildings. Making it very easy to keep sections open and importantly making money while sections are closed and replaced in phases. Basically your example of “what is possible” is terrible. The company already owns the majority of the site, so no huge land purchase, buying a site like Wonderland is much harder than your realize, size and cost matter, and bigger is not always better. Being able to close a small section at a time for redevelopment radically changes how a project is financed and means being able to keep using the rest of the site to generate revenue. It also allows them to stop at any point if there is an economic downturn or demand just does not exist at a viable price point. Projects get proposed frequently, and frankly I suspect the majority never happen. You really don’t seem to understand how business or development works.

Let’s look at this in actual numbers what would the land have to be worth to consider closing the park? The parks earnings in the last year that I have available appears to be around 50 million a year USD, based on current exchange rates that’s roughly 65 million CAD. Typically a standard multiplier would be around 15. If the chain considers the park having good growth potential it would be higher than that, if they feel it does not it could be a little lower. At 15 your looking at $975 million CAD or roughly 750 million USD. At 20 it would be 1.3 billion Canadian dollars. The $310 million USD price for CGA is actually a multiplier around 40, which would put the land price at CW over 2 billion. I have a hard time believing a company would offer the $1+ billion dollars to buy the land it would cost to justify selling.

Easily, less towers and a shorter cable. When the one at Kings Island was moved from Coney Island it was actually lengthened, and a new tower was fabricated and added. The ride had three towers at Coney and four at KI.

The sky ride that was at Kings Island was relocated from Coney Island, and several other installations have been moved before, the one at Great Adventure is relocated from the Worlds Fair in Queens. All of these sky rides were built by one company Von Roll who also built the one at Cedar Point. The old Kings Island sky ride was the model that had small 2 person gondolas. This is a larger model with 4 person gondolas like what’s at Cedar Point. CGA has a pretty big installation, they have enough towers and cabins to basically get a third of a mile easily. For instance a station near Orion would stretch to Planet Snoopy, going over the launch tunnel on Flight of Fear, and the lift hills of Racer. Station between Racer and Flight of Fear could almost stretch to the Picnic Grove.

The exchange rate matters because the park earns money in Canadian Dollars and all earnings and profits are reported in US Dollars. While I don't have the prices for funnel cakes easily available I can compare the prices for season passes and tickets. Every Cedar Fair park charges the same price for a platinum pass, no matter the currency. A platinum pass at Kings Island is $240 USD, at Canada's Wonderland it is $240 CAD. Which is why I know several people who renew their pass on Canada's Wonderlands website instead of at a US parks. You get charged tax but the exchange rate more than makes up for the difference. A gold pass at KI is $140 USD, at CA it's $120 CAD. A single day ticket online is $49.99 USD or CAD. At the gate a ticket to Kings Island is $85 USD, while Canada's Wonderland is $75 CAD. I wish I had the prices of funnel cakes available I think you would be surprised.

Cedar Fair used to publish this data annually, sadly its been a few years. But look at these graphs, and really look at the one on the right, EBITDA, and compare the tiny little slice that is CGA and the much larger wedge that is CW. Is this a few years old? Yes, but frankly it does not change that much. The exchange rate is even similar today to what it was in 2016. CW is roughly 10% in the graph, 10% of $481 million is $48 million USD. That's how much the park was making a year. The $310 million dollars that Cedar Fair is getting for CGA is like 40 years of profits at CGA, but only a little over 6 at CW.

There is a giant difference between the two, profitability. CGA was barely making any money. This information is a few years old but Canada's Wonderland was 4th or 5th in profitability, roughly around Carowinds, a lot of this is the exchange rate. But this is still a lot of money. Unless something major changes the park is safe, the chain can make more money operating it as a theme park then selling the land. Which is the key its worth more as a park then being sold, which was not the case for CGA. When people say regulations surrounding CGA's closure. Its the height limits, the noise problems due to being near companies, parking issues, earthquake protection, etc. None of which effects Canada's Wonderland. CGA had a 35 ft height restriction until a few years ago, every single attraction was a fight. The park had potential but it was going to be expensive and a risk that the chain would never make the money back. There is none of these issues with Canada's Wonderland. Land prices would need to not just be as expensive as California, they would have to be higher maybe a lot higher before its worth it to sell. I have been worried about CGA for a while, I have zero concerns for CW.

The last year Cedar Fair published revenue and profit graphs which showed the individual parks in relation to each other was back in 2015 or 2016. But at the time CGA was middle of the chain for revenue, but either last or next to last in profitability. It was basically making around the same amount of money as Michigan's Adventure. Which is actually a huge improvement, a few years before that the park was dead last for profitability and it was not even close. The park is incredibly expensive to operate. I suspect Cedar Fair decided that the cost of continuing to invest is just not worth the returns they are getting. Especially when they are offered enough money to justify closing the park. At this point I am left wondering, when will the park close? I cannot see it being operated for another 11 years, it might be possible due to the lease but its up to 11 years, not that it will be 11 years, frankly I give it 2 or 3 years unless it sees a huge uptick in attendance due to the pending closure. What will move? I would love to see the Sky Ride move, shoot that would be an amazing addition to Kings Island, but its so old I wonder if Cedar Fair will move it. Old coasters like Demon, Woodstock Express, and Grizzly just seem like they will be scrapped. B&M coasters will likely be moved, so Flight Deck and Patriot. The only other coaster that I am pretty sure that will be moved is RailBlazer. Psycho Mouse might be moved, might be sold, but I do not think it will be scrapped. Gold Striker is a huge question mark, but I could see it being moved, its a lot of work to move a wood coaster but its pretty new and a very good layout.

I am familiar with how the frisbee rides get stuck upside down I would assume this would be similar. The motor turns off as the arm approaches the top and the control system waits until the arm reaches a set point before reengaging the motor, so it is just coasting over the top. It would be very easy to produce too strong of forces if the motor was engaged at all times. In a case like this a gust of wind or something else at just the right or for the riders wrong moment provides enough resistance the ride vehicle balances upside down. The ride system does not see the motion it is expecting so it faults and turns off power to the motor. On frisbee rides like the ones from SBF Visa when wind does eventually push the ride vehicle over since the ride faulted the motor will not engage to slow the arm, and it just swings back and forth for a long time before it stops allowing the ride op to release the passengers.

Here is one from last week.

The old tower drinks queue never made any sense. I was at the park Friday and you could just see how much of a difference it was making. Racer queue is also a great change. Not sure who is driving these changes around the park but it fantastic seeing them. These kinds of tweaks add up to making a better overall experience.

We might not get too detailed of an answer but someone could try asking at a Q&A at Coasterstock, and if their version is still down at Cedar Point in a few weeks Coaster Mania. I would expect a vague answer without too many details but I would be surprised if there is no answer at all. I doubt they are trying to hide something. It’s just not something they are going to announce.

Last year Kings Island stored the bread in a warming box. This insures everyone gets a warm loaf, but could dry out the bread over time. I have not even been inside the French Corner yet this year, but I assume they are still doing this.

Might be something as simple as a more involved maintenance that’s only done every few years. Since all of the WindSeekers were built in a short period of time they would all need this around the same time. I was at Cedar Points Winterchill out and Raptor just hit that point and they were replacing major parts on every train due to age. Most of the WindSeekers are 10 years old either this year or last year. Design changes do not mean there is a flaw either. I would love for them to upgrade the controls to be able to tell the ride ops exactly which seat is not properly locked when checking restraints for instance.

The entire hill right before the second lift is covered in anti-rollbacks for a reason. If the train needs assistance it’s typically there. I think it’s important to point out I was talking about the very first handful of runs of a freshly rebuilt train. It takes a few runs for the train to break in, it can be just a little bit too much friction the first few runs.