I figured I'd post this as someone else probably would anyway. I got it from coasterbuzz and it talks about the B&M track manufacturer in Batvia. Anyways, it relates to PKI because it says in the article "Paramount's Kings Island does not have a B&M coaster, mostly due to the non-compete rights of other B&M coaster buyers, according to Miller." Which leads to the question does this mean PKI will never be able to get a B&M due to these rights? Or is the author of the article just mistaken?

weird, it would be really nice to see a B&M at the Island, B&Ms are so smooth...

I highly doubt that that is true. Afterall, the nearest park with a B&M is SFKK. And besides, if PKI was willing to fork up the money for a B&M, I`m sure B&M would sell them one. I doubt that any park has exclusitivity rights on ALL B&M coaster in the PKI area. While one park or another may have some sort of exclusitivity rights for a certain B&M ride, I doubt it applies to all their models.

Oh yea, I forgot to post the article if anyone wants to read it.

Article

When you look at the stats, the last B&M purchased by Paramount was in '99. Cedar Fair has been buying B&M's lately. Dorney got Talon in '01 and now Hydra in '05. Knott's got Silver Bullet in '04, and now Worlds Of Fun is getting Patriot in '06.

Needless to say, Six Flags buys a B&M about every year.

Its just a matter of time and space till Kings Island gets a B&M. Sadly to say, with Vortex leaving the park in five or so years, they are going to replace it with another big steel ride. Who knows, the park may even expland somewhere and put another steel there.

I dont think B&M would tell their fabricator that they have agreements like that, its more company buisiness then anything.

I doubt Vortex will be going anywhere soon. That being said, I think the park may have big plans for the 2007 season.

Yeah a B&M multilooper will replace Vortex and the new B&M woodie will replace SOB. Some people will not let rumors go.

LOL... "no compete?"

B&M is a major coaster manufacturer that wants to sell as much of their product as possible. Should PKI want a B&M, then B&M would sell them one. I doubt any coaster manufacturer would be silly enough to restrict themselves regionally as to being able to sell.

Now if a manufacturer were working in cahoots with a park to produce a prototype coaster or ride, then I would expect that they would give the park exclusive rights to that design... at least for a year or so.

But in today's frugle world of Amusements, any manufacturer would be silly to restrict themselves from selling their product to whomever desired it.

Re: B&M and PKI.... it's no big secret that Bolliger and Mabillard have been at PKI numerous times in years past proposing coaster designs. The most significant proposal that came about 5 years ago. It was a proposed hyper coaster in the rear of the park that was slated to occupy the land from the turnaround of The Racer back through the heavy terrain lands toward the Little Miami River. However Paramount Parks declined the design. This was just one of several proposals that Paramount Parks turned down for PKI.

Because of numerous declines, it's my understanding that B&M has ceased proposing coasters to the Paramount chain. With the understanding that only serious intent to install would attract their attention in the future.

Shaggy

Hey thanks Shaggy I never knew that I wish PKI would get a B&M.

The most significant proposal that came about 5 years ago. It was a proposed hyper coaster in the rear of the park that was slated to occupy the land from the turnaround of The Racer back through the heavy terrain lands toward the Little Miami River. However Paramount Parks declined the design. This was just one of several proposals that Paramount Parks turned down for PKI.

Shaggy

Would this coaster have been contending with the Son of Beast concept?

I have to admit that would be really cool! I wonder why paramount shot the designs down?

"I wonder why paramount shot the designs down? "

Several reasons....

Al Webber (CEO of Paramount Parks division) is of the "It's gotta have a gimmick" school. For some reason he thinks that coaster installs have to be technical marvels, or state of the art attractions. They dont. They just have to be fun.

Paramount Parks recognize that increased revenue resides in families, not thrill seekers. When coasters are installed, you cut your drawing audience nearly in half.

Money. Buying a B&M is literally like purchasing a Rolls Royce in the coaster world. They are the creme of the crop. And Paramount Parks tends to be stingy at times. They would rather rely on a cheaper manufacturer for the ride unit, so they can spend monies on theming elements that seemingly do nothing for the rides themselves, or budget the money for improvements elsewhere in the park.

Shaggy

A Mini is no Rolls Royce. I wonder what the park is going to be like in years. It's like it is losing the magic it once had. It may be me getting too old for it.

Actually IJST is a great example.

It's obvious to me that the attention was not spent on the actual coaster itself. Heck, it's simply a small mine-train type ride with a launch. However look at the $ they sunk into making it chock full of "technology."

On board sound... that doesn't work.

Scenic effects... that you pass by too rapidly.

Mid-ride show... that is a shell of it's original intention.

Headlights on trains... that do not work.

I like IJST.... I think it's "cute." And it's a great family ride.

However so much was sacrificed along the course in order to make it a "marvel" that the basic idea of a simply fun and satisfying ride kind of took back seat.

On the flip side, if you take a look at Delirium (although not a coaster) the ride was simply purchased and installed. It has very few bells and whistles (other than that pesky hydraulic floor) and simply was built to be a fun ride. It has succeeded immensely on multiple levels... most importantly guests LOVE it. It was sort of a fluke install, and is IMO, the best new product that the park has installed in 20 years.

Shaggy

Oh man I really dont care for IJ:ST and all the things you listed shaggy are the reasons why.

Shaggy you talk about shot down conepts, wasnt there a concept for having a copy of volcano installe din the park but do to the lack of the mountain and the cost it was shot down? Ive heard quite a few concepts that never made it but if you could share more that would be great!

I have also heard that Volcano was suppose to make it's way to PKI I wonder what type of concepts/themes were shot down.

I somewhat remember Jeff Siebert talking about a concept for a wood coaster that was planned to go near Tiques on the RvT side, but that idea got shot down. He mentioned it at an IJST construction tour. All I remember about it was that it was going to go over the path along the lake in RvT (because I commented on how cool I think that would be.)

^ That would have been awsome! seems like all the great ideas get shot down.

^I asked Jeff Seibert about that idea on the last tour and he said we were supposed to get a Hurler clone and that Happy Days was going to become Stan Mikitas.

Its ashame that Paramount Parks does not want to invest in that B&M coaster for Kings Island. They are incredibly fun rides, and seem to be ejoyed by lots of people. True, they do alient the non coaster riders of the market. But, you need something new and thrilling to keep the thrill seekers coming to the park. While PKI can rake in money from families, they are not the only ones who spend money at the park. (After all, those kids have to ride something when they outgrow the kiddie rides, right?)

Yes, it seems like PP would rather buy a cheap ride unit. Then they upgrade it with theming and special effects that only degrade with the passing months and seasons. IJST is a fun coaster, and had some cool idead. Unfortunately, the onboard audio and working headlights, which IMO, are essential to the "whole" experience of the ride don`t work most of the time. It is still a fun ride, but the lack of operable effects detracts from the experience. One of the biggest complaints I heard from people was how short the ride was. They liked the ride, but wished it had been longer.

Hopefully, PKI and PP will give us a nice treat in 2007, to commemorate the park`s 35th anniversary. But I highly doubt that it will be a high capacity B&M coaster that everyone has been wanting. Just my $.02, although I wouldn`t be complaining if we got one!

Upon thinking, Vortex wont be replaced with a B&M. They will build the B&M somewhere else, then keep both the coasters running, and when Vortex becomes less popular, they let it run down, and dismantle it and install somthing there in a year or 2.

On the flip side, if you take a look at Delirium (although not a coaster) the ride was simply purchased and installed. It has very few bells and whistles (other than that pesky hydraulic floor) and simply was built to be a fun ride. It has succeeded immensely on multiple levels... most importantly guests LOVE it. It was sort of a fluke install, and is IMO, the best new product that the park has installed in 20 years.

Shaggy

Agreed. It seems like the attractions over the past few years have been hyped up to be more than they actually are. When exiting Tomb Raider or Italian Job, the complaint I hear most often is some form of "Well, that was nice, but is that all?" (This coming from teenage and older guests) It wasn't until recently that I heard this after riding Delirium, which might be attributed to what seems to me to be a shorter ride cycle now that the broken gear has been replaced.

Would themeing that actually works solve this problem? From an enthusiast's perspective it certainly would, and when considering the general public I don't see how it could hurt. If Tomb Raider actually had all the flame and lighting effects working in the queue, and the sparks, lighting, fog, sound, water, statue eyes, I think many people would have their "that's it?" sentiment reduced drastically. The same goes for Italian Job's flame, water, fishtailing, staircase, lighting, fog, helicopter, sound, effects and general themeing as well.

I don't expect PKI to be Disney, with ten-minute flume rides with such incredible themeing they are more exciting than a roller coaster (my true opinion), but with the current advertising, that's what I'm led to believe. The kid zones are incredible, but those kids grow up, and want something else to do.

I hope pki gets something great ride in 2007. If you ask me they just wasted money on italian job stunt track. They are do good with family rides its just they need soemthing NEW for thrill seekers!

i have said it once before and ill say it again, thrill seekers are apart of the "Family" to.

^Yeah and when thrillseekers start bringing in the money like the families do then we'll get huge massive coasters, however since Viacom and Paramount want to make money.........theyre gonna focus ont he money..........family and theme. PKI is no Disney..............yet..............but thats how disney got so succesful.........by focusing on the family and theming their parks to their movies. Yeah, id love PKI to get a bi B&M however you people need to look at the facts......the thrill seekers arent bringing in the money......families are.......and thats who PKI is going to focus on so quit your whinging.

and thats who PKI is going to focus on so quit your whinging

I'm whinging? Funny, but everything you said is true. PKI has said it over the last five or six years and are still saying it.......they are going to focus on the total family experience. So, now, cry me a river, build a bridge, and get over it.

^I wasnt saying you were whining PKIbeast.

I don't know what rides B&M manufactures- but PKI would kick tail by getting a heavily themed ride like Spiderman or Dueling Dragons at Universal Florida.

I agree with the IJST comments... the ride starts getting interesting...... then it's over. This was not a Paramount thing... the the absolute largest LET DOWN of any roller coaster ever made was the build up/exit to the loading station on Adventure Express. I remember my first time riding that thinking "i bet the track is going to go straight down after this tunnel." then you come down and gently ride into the loading area.

B&M manufactures roller coasters. They are responsible for Deuling Dragons and the Incredible Hulk at Islands of Adventures, among countless other coasters at parks across the country and the world. Spiderman, I believe was designed and created in house by the team that developed Islands of Adventure.

Other Paramount Parks have B&M coasters (Paramount`s Carowinds and Paramount`s Great America). The last B&M install at a Paramount Park was Top Gun: The Jet Coaster at Paramount`s Carowinds in 1999. I would gladly have taken that ride over Face Off! (Although I wouldn`t want to give up Drop Zone for it). Hopefully, one day in the future PKI will build a B&M. Until then, we can dream about PKI getting one!